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Is anyone here an "investor" nomad?

 

by @gizmocaca | 4yr  | 22 comments

Hi. Newbie here.
Wondering if anyone here has expertise in being an โ€œinvestorโ€ nomad where you travel and live off investment income? Iโ€™m contemplating fleeing the rat race and wanted to throw out a few thoughts and ideas.

Have a UK passport so donโ€™t get taxed on worldwide income whilst non-resident.
Iโ€™m thinking of residency in Malaysia (MM2H) or Philippines (Retirement visa).

In terms of generating tax efficient income:

  • HK, Singapore and UK donโ€™t withhold tax on equity dividends or preference shares
  • USA doesnโ€™t tax capital gains (but has nasty estate taxes on equities) for non-residents
  • USA debt securities (CDs/corp debt) do not withhold tax (w8-ben)
  • USA based p2p lending should be same as debt securities asset class hence no withholding
  • Eurobonds do not withhold tax on interest payments (look to have a spread of local currency bonds).

Would look to supplement by buying property (have my eyes on a few places in Philippines) to rent out. Would also look to invest in local businesses wherever I find opportunities.

Appreciate any advise or insight people might have!

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@miked | 3yr

Another nomad investor here, but my investments are mostly passive, with a few rental properties and index funds, in addition to my main business.
Iโ€™m always tempted to invest in some properties wherever I travel, but one thing I learned is you have to really know and understand the area if you want to get good returns from a real estate investment. I think itโ€™s only worth investing in areas where you live, or at least spend most of the time, return often.

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@gizmocaca | 3yr

Agreed. I did buy some properties in Philippines. Took a while to find right people / locations / buildings. Might try to scale it up with other investors at some point but donโ€™t feel comfortable yet until it proves itself over time. The country is growing quickly so itโ€™s an interesting bet.

Away from that gradually building a bond portfolio with investment grade and โ€œhighโ€ non-investment grade bonds (and some pref shares too). Mostly long dated. Interest rate cycle / credit cycle at their peaks so not being particularly aggressive.

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@ms_maire | 4yr

There are a great deal of people doing this, generally older people. NomadList is mostly younger people / millenials but if you were older and had a few kids youโ€™d be meeting lots of people who do this.

In fact, I would say a decent percentage of nomad families with kids are simply living off the income of a rental property back โ€˜homeโ€™ wherever that is.

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@gizmocaca | 4yr

Thanks! Do you know if any make property investments whilst on the road? I would imagine itโ€™s a bit of a minefield legally and youโ€™re always a โ€œdumbโ€ foreigner.

Iโ€™m also interesting in micro finance, i.e. if locals or nomads have a good idea, which they are passionate about, then maybe help with the financing albeit with an ownership stake. Suspect there are plenty of opportunities in growing countries.

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@gizmocaca | 4yr

Thanks. Iโ€™m going to give being an โ€œinvestor nomadโ€ a try. I have plenty of experience in the industry and think a blog about income investing (rather than speculating) from a nomad perspective might be well received. Iโ€™m not the biggest fan of stocks because of their volatility but they would certainly form part of the strategy. Retail investors should be able to get access to other products nowadays if you look in the right places.

Currency is an interesting one. Iโ€™ll probably benchmark myself against USD as thatโ€™s the worldโ€™s currency but I should be matching off against my local needs. Iโ€™ll post a link here once Iโ€™m up and running (will be a few months yet).

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@blueblueocean | 4yr

Yeah I think Iโ€™d consider myself investment nomad supplementing with part-time and other passive income streams. You need an income stream. You can draw against your investments at the moment via low interest margin loan but unless your investments grow in 1-3 years by the amount you need to get around, you will be pinched when markets are volatile.

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@travelingpm | 4yr

We come across a few nomad tradersโ€ฆnot so much the real estate investors you speak of. Iโ€™m trading stock on top of managing our business, earning about $1400/m via trading. Would I invest in a property and trade 40-60% annual yield for maybe 10% and upkeep, hell no.

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@gizmocaca | 4yr

40-60% returns are fantastic! I personally donโ€™t have the risk appetite for that.

I see property as a nice tangible asset which is inflation linked and pays a steady income stream. Itโ€™s less of an efficient market than finance too. Though as a foreigner youโ€™re probably getting screwed.

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@travelingpm | 4yr

Max drawdown on the account has been 8%, so little risk thus far. Thatโ€™s not to say next month I could draw down to 10-20%, but having a strong trading plan and treating it like a business helps prevent that.

Itโ€™s not just locals taking advantage of you as a foreigner. We bought property in South Africa, then the currency dropped 30% to the USD. We resold the house for the same price we bought it for, but ultimately lost 30% when we pulled our money out of SA. So yeah been there, got screwed, and now I prefer liquidity in this kind of market.

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@busdriver | 4yr

โ€œfocus on making money doing whatever it is that you are good atโ€ - yes, I think so. Unfortunately itโ€™s banks and investment firms that are good in being investors.

Can one really expect to make a profit of 2 digits without any risk (like the recent ยฃ drop) ?

But yes, you can become good in making good money in a niche. Just before you have to become very good at it โ€ฆ Than you might even be able to sell that service to others.

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@gizmocaca | 4yr

Hi - some great advice and links here, thanks. Would also add http://www.financialsamurai.com/ as a link. This guy is ex-finance who takes a conservative approach to passive investments (a bit US centric though for nomading).

What Iโ€™m likely to do is to (and will blog and geek out about it eventually).
1.) Setup brokerage accounts with likes of TD, Schwab, Interactive Brokers
2.) Try to replicate Bloomberg style market data sources using Quandl and maybe other cheaper sites (Stockopedia) to identify opportunities.
3.) Trading relatively passively rather than speculatively, in instruments that provide regular income (i.e. government & corp bonds/preference shares/REITS/p2p) in jurisdictions which are tax efficient for Nomads. Irish Base ETFs are best for US equities I believe but direct buying works for Bonds in USA. Other jurisdictions may also be interesting.
4.) Look to hedge out lifestyle choices i.e. invest in ZAR, BRL, IDR, TRY high yielding bonds if I plan to visit South Africa, Brazil, Indonesia and Turkey.
5.) Buy aggressively during market downturns (especially generally mean reverting instruments).
And maybe I can earn money through the blog too!
For most people passive ETFs added to and held long term is probably best/easiest though.

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@yanokwa | 4yr

Study after study has shown that itโ€™s nearly impossible to make consistent money actively investing in the stock market [1,2]. The recommendation from those who study these things is to focus on making money doing whatever it is that you are good at and that provides value. Then take that money you earn and passively invest it in diverse, low-cost, tax-efficient mutual funds [3,4,5,6].

The investment approach (a.k.a, Modern Portfolio Theory) Iโ€™m advocating for is very easy to implement and gives you the best chance at making consistent money. Anything else is gambling, which I do (Bitcoin!) and is fine, but you should be upfront with yourself when you are gambling.

Anyway, just a word of advice from someone who has been investing (in my opinion, successfully) for about 20 years and has been nomading (in my opinion, successfully) for about 2 years.

[1] https://corporate.morningstar.com/US/documents/ResearchPapers/MorningstarActive-PassiveBarometerJune2015.pdf
[2] http://www.indexologyblog.com/2015/04/23/spiva-interpretation-and-misinterpretation/#sthash.CFGFJ3sV.dpuf
[3] http://longbets.org/362
[4] http://www.mrmoneymustache.com/2013/02/22/getting-rich-from-zero-to-hero-in-one-blog-post/
[5] https://www.bogleheads.org/wiki/Bogleheadsยฎ_investment_philosophy
[6] https://www.reddit.com/r/personalfinance

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@flyonthewall | 4yr

Fully agree. Passive investing (as with the markets lately) have been pretty flat though. However, I still believe that fund manager risk is way more important to avoid so passive (and low cost) is the way to go!

On the topic of being an investor, well I know wanderingtrader is a guy who trades stocks while traveling - so thatโ€™s one but itโ€™s not quite what this thread is about.

USA estate tax is not an issue if you invest through Irish domiciled index funds. So if you invest into Vanguard ETFs via Vanguard Ireland (you can buy on the LSE), then your investments are not located in the US and therefore are not subject to the estate tax.

Youโ€™ll still unfortunately suffer from the 15% dividend witholding tax that the US-Ireland treaty enforces. Soโ€ฆ yeah 15% less dividends but thatโ€™s the cost of participating in the US market as a foreigner. Or you could incorporate a US company and invest through that but then youโ€™ll have to deal with a lot of US buraeucracy and that might not be so good. Overall the cost of Vanguard funds is so competitive that the 15% dividend witholding evens it out with other alternatives. That itself makes them worth it.

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@busdriver | 4yr

main rule - more important than ever - spread widely. Different kinds of investment projects, currencies, countries, โ€ฆ stocks can be part of it but you might want to look further.
I have my problem to see that nowadays traditional long-term investing actually pays off (see house price, ยฃ and stock drop from time to time - the last one was because of Brexit).
But if you look, you can find interesting options, that are hands-off investments, that make 5-8% in interests instantly + have some potential and are fairly secure (urban property in mayor western cities).

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@syneryder | 4yr

You can find opportunities like that on the stock market too (at least on the Australian market). One of my stocks now yields 15% just on dividends, and itโ€™s a huge supermarket chain. The key/catch is that I bought in at its lowest point during the 2008 Global Financial Crisis - as the company rebuilt & grew, so did its dividend payouts.

Itโ€™s worth filtering for companies with > 8% yield in case you find stable companies that are temporarily bargain priced. But you need to do your research - donโ€™t buy into a company thatโ€™s about to go bankrupt! I posted a little more about that over at Hacker News too.

I couldnโ€™t live off my portfolio though. Itโ€™s been helpful additional income, but I need to keep freelancing & selling products to raise the capital for investing!

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@travelingpm | 4yr

Seaspan Corp (SSW) is in a similar position if youโ€™re looking for US equities. The stock has a 10% dividend and .92 price to book ratio.

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@jessehanley | 4yr

If you can pull a stable income from this and know what youโ€™re doing, sure. I know people doing this and they love the game.

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@busdriver | 4yr

Do you plan to do nothing at all as an investor? Or maybe be more like adding your life experience to it too?

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@gizmocaca | 4yr

The plan is to create a core relatively passive income stream which takes care of living costs.

Then spend rest of time investigating different life options. Business, learning, charity and building skills.

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@eri | 4yr

Hi @pclondon76

I am a newbie as well here, this is my first comment ever.

Not an investor yet but there is this podcast and site that might help you:

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@gizmocaca | 4yr

Thanks Eri. Iโ€™ll check it out.

Once started I might blog about how to do it. I know about financial markets but less about international tax and local investing.

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@simonl | 4yr

Also new here and my first response. Iโ€™d be interested in your blog. I dont know about financial markets and investing but have some cash that I dont know what to do with but looking to maintain and improve my nomadic lifestyle.

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Read and participate in 13,974 discussions on Nomad List

Suggested topics

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Anyone wants to learn to sail in the Mediterranean? (Sep or Oct)


by @viktor | 1mo 1 month ago | 1 comment

I'm thinking about taking a sailing (yachting) course in the Mediterranean Sea this coming September or October. Thus far from my research, it seems that most courses are held in locations with not many digital nomads. My thinking is that it would be more fun to go to a place with like-minded people. Therefore, I'm wondering if anyone else is interested in taking a sailing course in the Mediterranean this fall? If not, do you know a location that offers good sailing courses, where there is also many digital nomads / nomad infrastructure?

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Any Ph.D students dissertating while a digital nomad?


by @larsheather | 4mo 4 months ago | 5 comments

Anyone know of any groups or resources for Ph.D. students working on dissertation while living as a digital nomad? I know there are several virtual writing groups around, but wondered if there were any specifically for digital nomads, particularly those who are dissertating.

Thanks!

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Anyone want to share an airbnb villa in Mexico?


in Mexico by @wouternomad | 5mo 5 months ago | 1 comment

I will be traveling/working through Mexico with my dog February to April. My plan is to stay in Sayulita for about 2-4 weeks, then travel south along the cost.

Is there anyone who wants to share an airbnb apartment? I was thinking of renting a private villa, but because these are large and have multiple rooms, I was wondering if there are fellow nomads wanting to share? Iโ€™m open to other locations as well (Puerto Vallerta, Oaxaca, and everything in between these two locations.

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How do you invest internationally as a nomad?


by @mateuszwieloch | 5mo 5 months ago | 17 comments

I have finally saved enough money to start investing. What company gives good, diversified access to stock, ETFs and mutual funds? Does it make sense to use company like Vanguard or Fidelity for that? Iโ€™m a EU/Poland citizen, how would I transfer my money back and forth without incurring significant fees?

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Has anyone created a list of co-living spaces around the world?


by @keegansard | 5mo 5 months ago | 4 comments

Iโ€™m a big believer in co-living but Iโ€™m finding hard to find all the options available in different cities.

I have found the major players like Roam, The Collective, and WeLive but havenโ€™t found many others.

Has anyone seen a list or should I start making one?

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I dream of being a digital nomad? How do I do it?


by @programmingmark | 6mo 5 months ago | 2 comments

Hello digital nomad!

I dream of being an independent digital nomad. But it feels very elusive & unattainable with my success rate. In full disclosure, whilst I have dreamed about making money online since high school; I have not earned a single cent making money online. $0, nada, zilch!! On the contrary, I have spent a lot of time & money on books, podcasts. Even though I have spent a lot of time reading/listening to others, I do not have anything to show for it!

I have made attempts in the past to start an online business, but these fizzle out quite quickly when I do not see traction especially when the goal I have set myself is too high.

Instead of reaching for the ultimate nomadic lifestyle goal, I want to start much smaller. Really small! I am simply looking to make $50 profit per month from a new online business. Thatโ€™s it.

I need some advice from you please!

  • Is $50 profit too low? How long did it take you to earn $50 profit per month?

  • What is a good way of achieving this goal?

Thanks
Mark
aka the $0 online business entrepreneur

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Anyone know an accountant for Canadian nomads/expats?


by @noam_lightstone | 7mo 7 months ago | 16 comments

Hey guys, this was my first year as a Canadian nomad.

As far as I know of, Canadians donโ€™t pay taxes if they do not live in the country for 6 months.

But Iโ€™d like to talk to an accountant or someone who does Canadian taxes specifically for expats and nomads to get clear on the rules and for help on my return coming up.

Does anyone know someone who specializes in Canada who can help? Iโ€™ve seen plenty of US recommendations but none for us canucks.

Thanks guys!

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Has anyone been terminated by Project Fi?


by @jackgopack | 8mo 7 months ago | 15 comments

Any long terms Project Fi users cancelled?

Planning on being outside of the US for a year or more and disappointed to just discover their โ€œtermination for excessive international roamingโ€ fine print (similar to T-Mobileโ€™s) as follows:

โ€œThe Services must be primarily used in the United States and are not intended for extended international use. Further, the Services are designed for use predominantly within our network. If your usage outside our network is excessive, abnormally high, or cause us to incur too much cost, we may, at our option and sole discretion, suspend your Project Fi account, terminate your service, or limit your use of roaming.โ€

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Do you "out" yourself as a digital nomad?


by @larsheather | 1yr 1 year ago | 2 comments

When you meet new people or reconnect with old friends, do you โ€œoutโ€ yourself as a digital nomad? The simple question โ€œwhere do you live?โ€ makes us uncertain now. We wonder if some places may be less welcoming to digital nomads, or if โ€œdigital nomadโ€ has a negative connotation in some places. If you are forthcoming from the start, does your status as a digital nomad make it hard to form friendships?

We would love to hear how other people navigate thisโ€ฆ how to balance being authentic in relationships vs. withholding the context (and allowing people to assume youโ€™re on vacation, for example).

Thanks!

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What's the best bank account for a global nomad?

 

by @barrybjjoubert | 1yr 1 year ago | 25 comments

Dear all
As a wanna be nomad figuring out a way to get free of the rat race, I was wondering what is the best bank account to have while travelling the globe? I need an account where is easy for me to receive payments from all over the world and it also need to be a bank that I can find almost anywhere in the world. I want to avoid carry cash on me if itโ€™s possible.

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Ko Lanta or Ko Phangan - which island is better for a digital nomad?


in Ko Lanta, Thailand by @melinda | 1yr 1 year ago | 6 comments

Iโ€™m currently in Penang, Malaysia and I was thinking to head to Thailand next. What are the best islands in Thailand to get some work done? I was considering either Ko Lanta or Ko Phangan because those both islands have coworking spaces. I might need to take some client calls, also video. Is the wifi good enough? Are there any other differences between the islands?

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Can anyone recommend a good Spanish language learning program in Alicante or Valencia?


in Valencia, Spain by @charliemartel | 1yr 1 year ago | 0 comments

Iโ€™m looking to spend 1-3 months in Alicante or Valencia this fall and would like to take a Spanish class there.

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Where should I register my company as a digital nomad? Singapore, Hong Kong?


in Singapore by @raphadk | 1yr 1 year ago | 14 comments

Hey guys, hereโ€™s a question Iโ€™ve been asking nomads I meet everywhere, but still havenโ€™t found good information. My startups mostly focus on american and european markets but I donโ€™t have a registered company, nor I live permanently on any of these countries.

I get the cash payments online in paypal (or adsense) and transfer it to Thailand (or Malaysia, or Bali, or Brazil, or wherever Iโ€™m at). The thing isโ€ฆ for low volume living expenses it seems fine, but as I scale the business, Iโ€™m starting to think more and more about fiscal law.

A fellow nomad told me to transfer it to Singapore, Hong Kong or The Virgin Islands, and then use an international credit card anywhere. I donโ€™t know if itโ€™s the best way to optimize thisโ€ฆ any ideas?

Also, could there be any problems in selling to these countries without a registered local company?

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Shikoku,can anyone help me with information about living there please


by @lofty | 1yr 1 year ago | 3 comments

Hi,
My name is Nick,currently living in Australia and looking at moving to Shikoku next year to live for a couple of years.My wife is Japanese,but I dont speak much though I have lived in Tokyo for some years previously.
Any advice on best areas to look at would be greatly appreciated ,

Thanks in advance
Nick

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Anyone have tips for preventing or getting over jet lag? ๐Ÿ˜“๐Ÿ˜ดโœˆ๏ธ


by @artofbryce | 2yr 1 year ago | 10 comments

We just finished our first stint around South East Asia and somehow survived 3 days of way too many flights, leaving me to feel like death.

Too much shitty airplane food, not enough sleep, big time difference from Mexico to SEA.

Anyone have tips to prevent that more in the future (aside from better flight plans)? More importantly, how do I recover faster from this horror?

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Can anyone recommend a good Swedish bank for European student?


by @raz | 2yr 2 years ago | 1 comment

The ideal bank will have an easy on-boarding as a European student studying and living in Sweden for a year and is merciful when it comes to sending GBP into the account.
Can anybody recommend a good Swedish bank? :raised_hands:

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Where to stay in Budapest as a digital nomad?


in Budapest, Hungary by @pparma | 2yr 2 years ago | 2 comments

HI, Iโ€™m from Argentina: new to Nomad List, and to digital nomad life in general :slight_smile:

I want to travel to Budapest on March for two months, can anyone recommend
the best area to stay?

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Does anyone plan on applying to the Vermont $10,000 remote work incentive?


by @wagmanben | 2yr 2 years ago | 5 comments

https://finance.yahoo.com/news/vermont-pay-10-000-move-110056645.html

Hello All,
Saw Vermont rolled out an incentive to get more remote workers to live there, Does anyone plan on applying and If so why? Reason Iโ€™m asking is I work for an organization in Tulsa, Ok that wants to also bring in Nomads, and would love to hear your thoughts on what such a plan should look like

Any help would be Awesome!
Ben

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Anyone know a good hairdresser in Amsterdam?


in Amsterdam, Netherlands by @abstaa | 2yr 2 years ago | 0 comments

Anyone know a good hairdresser in Amsterdam? Looking for something reasonably to the center!

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How do you receive physical mail as a digital nomad?

 

by @danielgenser | 2yr 2 years ago | 81 comments

Does anyone have recommendations to handle physical mail? In the USA, Iโ€™ve noticed various services over the years where you get a physical address that you can change your address to, they receive your mail, scan stuff and send you PDFโ€™s.

Has anyone used these types of services? Impressions?

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